Welcome to the art of marketing operations, a tailor podcast. Here you can
grow your knowledge about marketing operations, listen to ideas and strategies to help you
scale, grow and optimize your efficiency, drive your speed to market and enrich
your work life. Let's get to it. Welcome to the art of marketing
operations, a tailor podcast. I'm Glen bottomly, and today my guest is
Neha Dod Bolada, Director of Digital Marketing Operations at macafee, the award winning
PC security software company that protects your personal information and online accounts from prying eyes,
hackers and data breaches with tools that put control of your information back into
your hands. Thanks for joining me today now. Thank you for having me,
Glen, what a pleasure. Well, today, since our podcast is
called the art of marketing operations, I thought it would be appropriate to start
talking about art, particularly because you are an accomplished artist yourself. You have
been invited to show your work at the India Art Summit, you had solo
art exhibitions with the Council General of India and you were named San Jose's young
artist of the year in two thousand and ten, and you even have a
beautiful and powerful piece of art in the Smithsonian Museum and and where you experience,
you explore the lived experiences, hardships in challenges of immigrants pursuing each one
be visus in the United States. Wow, can you just share a bit
about your passion for art, in the power of artistic expression? Yeah,
thank you. I mean when I when you just read that all back,
it just feels like I've come a long way in my artistic journey and it
kind of feels very accomplishing to hear somebody repeat that back to you, that
it made a difference to somebody else. But art is really an expression and
you know, from a very young age at home I was always encouraged to
speak my mind and share my thoughts and I think art became a medium.
I was encouraged by my mother particularly. She's very artistic. So I think
I do have a heritage of, you know, great lineage of art from
her. But that journey is is so immersive and and I really want to
enjoy. The most about the expression is the process. You know, art
is about, you know, testing and learning your boundaries, you know,
trying to figure out where your, you know, strengths are. You know
what you enjoy doing, what color mediums, what people mediums, etc.
So I do really enjoy the process about learning of how to use these different
varieties of things and, you know, put your your sensibilities on a piece
of paper and then allowing yourself to be one little will and put that in
front of somebody else and then making sure that your audience enjoys it is another
thing altogether. So for me it was really about the process. It was
also about expressing my innermost feelings, which is very hard to sometimes bend down,
especially around all the work that I've done. It has always revolved around
human emotions and how things and environments and people impact how humans evolve and the
process of like this hnb visa, the pursuit of the American dream. It
is an easy dreams aren't free and you really have to work very hard,
and folks forget that when somebody gets an H and visa, you know what
are some of the difficulties that person has gone through to actually achieve it and
should not be taken very lightly. So we have a great responsibility as a
society when we host migrants into our country, that it is not easy on
them, and either is it ease for us and you know, that was
really why I chose to do that piece of work. But it really is,
all around, just a very immersive process and kind of brings out your
most vulnerable sensor, sensitivities across. That's wonderful, what an incredible testimony to
the power of art. That's that's amazing and I myself personally have helped a
couple of individuals in my career at two different organizations, you know, earned
their h oneb as well. So I certainly understand the the challenge in the
journey and the difficulty of that. So thank you for your contribution to art.
So just beautiful. So now from the art of marketing operations. Moving
from art and that's now shift over to marketing operations. So you started your
marketing career at really the top of the sales funnel. You worked in customer
success and and Retention Marketing, loyalty marketing and more, but I know that
you've said that execution and operations was was really always the problem. You know,
campaigns were not executed well and and that that these problems were sort of
the genesis, the catalyst for you to really shift into marketing operations. And
Revenue Operations, and I know that you've since managed email and message and website
social add technologies, you know, and more so. So clearly you've seen
a lot so far. So what has been really the biggest career learnings that
you have gained along the way and that you still draw upon today, and
and what gaps are questions do you see that still sort of plague marketing operations
executives today? Yeah, it's it's a big question too. On Saint,
let's on impact that a little bit, because that journey from becoming a market
at an operations person or an operations personnel was quite a natural to me.
I think I had spend so much time learning about how marketing happens in an
organization, how customers behave, what their journeys look like, and at every
single point it became apparent to me that the execution and the precision in the
execution and the time in which the execution happens really made the difference and impact
to the customer. So it really amazed me, delighted me and also bothered
me that we weren't able to meet the customer at the expectations that they were
asking for. So it was curiosity that led me into operations to understand what
a what were we not doing or what could we do better that would help
that customer make the decision today, because ultimately the business is about customer making
their choice and you want them to make the choice for your for your product,
for your service. So how do I help them? So that's number
one, which is as a marketer I was I was solutioning around the same
problem and as an operations person I was solutioning around the same problem. You
know, I like to give this analogy that my current manager tells me that.
You know, most of the Times organization build a great Ferrari, but
they don't have enough drivers to take it and use it. So we build
a great at you know technologies, we build a great product, but you
really need that last mile to be achieved for or customers to really experience your
product, experience the web, experience the way that the product that you have
built it to be. So the biggest challenges for marketers is usually getting your
idea from from paper into reality and the time that is needed to lift it.
You know, what are the some of the things that operations can come
in and help you figure out, like how do I get this idea from
paper to into into reality? The second question is around what do my customer
and customer needs are and when do they needed? Where do they need it?
What are the best channels? What are the best practices? Tell me
now, because there's so much information with technology today that really the application of
their information at the right time is the key to success. It isn't about
there is abundance of information today, but how do you utilize that information and
where in the funnel do you utilize it? You know, the ability to
test and learn and fail quickly, but, you know, really having the
power in the hands of the marketer to say, guess, I have fueled,
but can I do another test? Can I how rapid can I be?
How Agile can I be? Are My team's ready to, you know,
take this change? The ability to have flexibility in a team, to
pivot at a moment's notice, is where operations really comes in. And,
you know, last but not these really it is around the availability of the
right kind of data, like how does an organization use it? You know,
do you have a two way street between what your customers are doing online
through messages? How the interacting we do and is that data readily available to
put to use. So these are some of the reasons. Or, you
know, you know, you could say blockers that today marketers have that operations
and can come in and do the help evaluate. Where can we all jump
in and make these were close better for the business? Is that there's a
heap. It really does. In a couple of things that really really hit
me. There was how curiosity, the curiosity was one of the things that
really led you to two operations. I love that. But I also loved
in your response when you said how can we help the customers make the decision
to buy today, and just the way that you phrase that, I think
is so powerful, because that's really the the crux of the output of what
we do in in marketing, but particularly in marketing operations, is what how
do you incentivize, how do you propel, how do you encourage and move
that prospective customer and or customer to a purchase decision today? So the fact
that you even phrased it that way, that must be a wonderfully powerful way
that you lead your team that, if you have that is sort of the
true north for your team, that at the end of the day it's how
do I make my customer how do I encourage them to purchase and buy today?
And that's just really powerful. Yeah, yeah, and and everything revolves
around that customer right it. And it's a little bit about understanding human nature.
There's so much variety today. There's so much personalization available on the website,
in through other avenues. There is so much choice that the customer has
in such a hyper personalized environment. You know you have to differentiate, but
you, like I said, you also have to meet the customer at the
right place at the right time with the right benefits and the value that your
product brings to them for that momentary decision right that, that change in the
mindset that allows them to go from one stage of the funnel to the other
is really where the magic happens as to what what will make that customer flow
through your funnel faster, get closer to their decisions, allow their peers or
friends to help make a referral, you know, really buy into your loyalty.
It's all around that. And then there are these levels like grant and
add and you know, social that is going to help you surround this piece
of information and really bad the customers attention so that you're focusing them more and
more. But it is really about that next best decision the customer can take
or the next best motivation you can give your customer to move to the next
step. So really yeah, and it's you know. Then it brings the
question is, how do you align your teams to get to that vision?
What do you need to do to bring folks together? And those are different
levels of challenges or different levels or pratization that's required to like build a team
that understands, you know, what the roles of each individual isn't that funnel?
Who Does what and when? It has to be very clearly laid out.
MMM MM yeah, I love that in also the way that you phrase
that. You know you're moving someone through the funnel, but I like how
you phrase that. It's the next best motivation. What's the next best motivation
to move that customer through through that funnel? That's really powerful. So in
your current role leading a centralized operations team, you clearly have extensive financial metrics
that you measure, probably including our why cost analysis for technology expansion, you
know, cost ownership of the digital rown road map and in more so,
how confident are you with accuracy of your financial projections in metrics and what advice
can you give to our audience on how to increase confidence and accuracy? So
there are two parts to operations. One is in the pure digital marketing stack,
operations and enablement, and there's Rev wops, and in both cases I
think you look at, you know, the accuracy of ability to predict something
in different ways. So the revenue piece of it is quite finite, which
means what you what you sell, is what you make and you know the
impacts are very black and white and you you tend to look at pass baselines
and you know add your growth your year, and that Revenue Operation Stream is
quite repeatable. I think where the interesting jump comes in is understanding. You
know your markets, your where your growths are different regions. You know how
expansion is going to happen in them and how you go to market with.
You know new products and features and what kind of diversity in your revenue are
you going to bring in? So that piece is quite interesting. But the
other other half of digital operations, which is more around process, people and
technology, require a little bit of you know, nuanced look at how do
you measure success, because when it comes to people. There is no finite
number. I mean there's hours put in and you want to make sure that
what you put in into a resource is what you're getting out. So investments
and people and how do you realize those investments? And then it's technology.
Technology also means you know, the investment in new tech, adoption time and
the time to you know first revenue out of that technology and then scale,
and you know what are the in returns on that scale that you're going to
get into three four years. So it's a very long tailed production versus revenue.
OPS is quarter of a quarter, very fine night and has a shorter
deal. So you can look at it and two different ways. Right.
I think my my area of Experti today is in digital operations. And how
do you really measure a piece of work that is so intangible, like process
is intangible, but really required to make sure that you have the right velocity
and agility in your business and you're getting as much as possible, you know,
out of the quarter that you had decide that that you wanted to do.
Technology is getting you prepared and ready to actually execute on the right campaign.
So you're looking at building some fundamental base lines. You know, what
is it today that you'd like to measure that will give you that predictability and
understanding of whether you utilizing time people in place in the right way? Most
teams today use a scrum framework within which an engineering and operations team will,
you know, participate in and that is a finite time, a finite number
of projects get decided. And then you can individualize capacity and say, you
know, you've got an experson that covered, that's come into the team,
is going to do x, Y and Z project, which means they are
output is x, Y and Z and hence they've had this impact. So
creating that individual velocity chart, a capacity chart, is going to tell you
projections on how much in the next, you know, sprint are you going
to be able to achieve. Then comes to process. You know, process
is really a ability to get things done in a more organized way. So
what processes do you require to any Mo these teams to go faster, to
make tradeoffs, to make decisions in a way that doesn't impact this sprint movement?
And then it comes to technology, as to like what do we need
to scale faster? Where can we reduce manual effort and really, what are
the right investments to make and those together builds a picture. And then you've
got revenue ops attached to say hey, did we forecast this? Did we
have the right amount of people to do it? Did we have the right
tech? And now you've got a great big, you know, overview of
how your organization operates. It's wonderful. Yeah, I mean it's super powerful.
With how you're describing that too, because I also I really appreciate your
view of the really looking at it from the long tail perspective. You know
that it's not necessarily I mean, while the quarter over quarter revenue operations,
you know, calculations important without question, but by looking at it as a
constant, continuous improvement, you know, week over a week, month over
month, year over year. In having that sort of the long play in
mind, I think is it's a really powerful mindset that leads to compelling,
you know, a compelling sense of leadership. So with that, let's shift
a bit to talk a little bit about leadership and your role as a leader.
So what would you say are some of the structures, indoor processes that
you personally have put into place, you know, either now or in the
past, that enable your teams to do their best. Yeah, so,
you know, operations is such a backbone of any given organization. It's really
as a team. We have to understand how the nervous system operates today.
End For that, you require, like I said, very clear roles and
responsibilities in your team. So the way you want to structure your team is
according to how workflow happens today, in the order. You know. How
do we decide on our priorities? How do these priorities get built out into
actual strategies and then into campaigns and then into actual workflows? You want to
devise an operations team that is going to be allowing you to make this workflow
as smooth as possible and they're picking up the work in the exact place that
they need to it. It needs to be really like a, you know,
an engine that works continuously and rigorously and Qway, happens correctly in the
right places and quality is maintained. So roles, responsibilities and flows have to
be decided. Structures important. The second thing that's really important is accountability,
as to you know, the roles are set up in the right way,
but how you going to measure the the quality and accountability of that particular role,
and I like to be very clear with with our individuals on the team,
is to what part they play in the entire picture. Then you want
to also create a which is which is generally called a daisy right. WHO's
the driver? WHO's accountable, WHO's the contributor? And there shouldn't be a
moment in an organization's life where they have to think about who these people are,
because time is of essence. So you want to create the right daisy.
You want to also create the right thresholds for risk. So biggest problem
in any organization is when the challenge happens, when there are gaps in your
revenue, you have to pivot your strategy at a moment's notice. But you
also have to be ready, with the right kind of tradeoffs and risk taking
abilities to pivot from what you had set out to do earlier in the quarter
to change right and then you don't want a double guess. You want to
have your leadership ready on standby to make those choices. So have principles in
place as an organization to say these are how we're going to operate an in
case of, you know, gaps and in case of disasters, this is
how we're going to make decisions, make it super transparent to everyone how decisions
are getting made. And last but not least, it's really around aligning the
teams to a common goal. Even if teams today work in silos. There
isn't, you know, a success story. I haven't heard of folks really
owning one metric, one KPI that is shared across teams that have, you
know, accountability across multiple organizations. That drives the organization forward and then really
brings them together to make sure that what gets done within the quarter. So
I think as lead us, we are making sure that we are safe,
we protect our team, we protect the goals, but in an environment that
allows flexibility, innovation and speed. Wonderful, and I think that the piece
that really hits me there too, is, as you described, about having
principles in place on how decisions are being made, because then at that point,
that sense of transparency that you mentioned, it you are always falling back
on those principles because then, if you know, senior management, executive management,
comes and asks why are we doing it this way? Why did you
decide that? You're not you're not responding sort of in the moment. You're
responding to say we're going back to these core principles. This is why we
did what we did precise and then if we're questioning what we did, well
then let's question the principles correct so that then we can fix that in the
in the in the subsequent months or sprints for campaigns. But so I think
that that's really salient advice of really focusing on those sort of guiding principles truly
truly. So here's a thorny question for you, and I hear this occasionally
from some of our audience members. So if, if you believe that your
team needs more staff members, so let's say back to your examples earlier,
if you believe your team needs is more staff members to hit your goals,
how do you convince executive leadership to invest more in the team? Yeah,
and isn't that a question we always struggled with every quarter, every budget meeting.
Right there isn't a day that has gone by. What I have.
I've heard that we're all satisfied with the resources that we have, but it
really again, I know, I think I have my ten steps to reduction
on this and I and I go and I use these ten steps to analyze
and think from a lens, from a leadership perspective, as to what leaders
are given very tight budgets, they're given a very short time and they have
to achieve a lot. So I'm really thinking of how do you help someone
make a decision? They are my customer. Right again, it comes back
to customer decisionmaking, so let's help them. It really about. It's about
identifying what the work is really what is that project, whether it is impacting
our customers, is it impacting sales revenue? And have alignment, foremost across
all teams that this work is important. It goes back to the principles.
Is it aligning to my principles, as aligned to the goals, and is
this, as a company, important to us? Once we've gotten that out
of the picture, there is no double questioning on the road ahead, which
is let's now try to solution this. Then we go look inside and say,
Hey, do we have the skill set today within our teams, because
often leadership is asking, Hey, do we not have people? Can we
search this particular person resource? You really want to have a process of elimination
to say we know what the work is, we don't have the skill set
for it and we need to find it in the market. You know when
do you need this person by? What is the critical milestone date that the
company's trying to hit for this work to be done? So like really have
the sense of urgency created on this role. And then you know what are
the expected outcomes of this person right when, when resources are required, what
is the outcome? What does the impact to our bottom line that this particular
addition is going to make? And then we have to think from the long
tail. As I said, resourcing is not just a short lived in activity.
It's an exercise that takes a toll across teams because you need to have
an employee burden figured out. You want to make sure that person has a
career, you want to be a cognitive about their goals and you know,
individual growth, etc. So will really thinking about the longitivity. Is this
a repeatable action? Is is something where their team wants to grow? And
Really, as you put this down on paper and you go through my ten
steps of deduction, I think we all come to the same you know,
outcome. So I think this is the mythology that I've used that has worked
really well because it leaves no room for doubt at the end as to why
we need the extra help. M thank you. So let's shift now,
then, from people in let's shift over to MARTEC. So I know that
you take a holistic approach to mar tech. You look at, you know,
email, reliability, c Ms Systems, up times, open bugs,
product launches, etc. So how do you then prioritize the Plethora of information
coming at you to help make the decisions on where your team needs to then
invest their time and resources? Today? Yeah, again comes back to pratization
alignment. I think the the foremost question is do we have a common goal
to are we all aligned to a priority as a as a company, as
an organization, and really where do we need to invest? The time comes
from that central question. So every quarter, that is the porization exercise that
the teams go through. Every team have, you know, makes it happen
in a very different way, whether it is aligning to our goals, aligning
to certain product launches, events, misters of a customers life, etc.
And then you really start deciding, you know, who is the same on
this, who is a subject level expert on your team that is going to
help answer this question and solution fast, and then you put them on that
on that task which allows people to come together. They they become your drivers
to bring folks together and say, let's analyze impact, let's analyze what the
customer experience is going to be, and then, you know, come up
with a number, a level of effort that is required to make that work
happen, because oftentimes they will be competing priorities. You can have the same
impact for two different campaigns, but you only have, you know, one
resource that is going to work on is. So how do you decide that?
And then it comes down to that number, and which goes back to
my baseline metric whiskers, to say, you know, if it if in
a scrum, it requires twenty percent of a scrum time to do x and
Y and C, but another campaign requires eighty percent of its scrum time.
You only get to do one. Which one will work better? So you
need to have all these decision levels in place for teams to come together and
analyze it from every point of view and then you decide that priority. So
I think we can all answer this in many different ways, but this is
my way of deciding what really is the priority. You know, do I
have enough information to make the choice? And going back to my principles to
say why I made it without a doubt. Yeah, well, and I
think I think the in if you say that, with everything from the people
in the technology that you just mentioned, I know that when we've shared it
in the past that you know you sort of described the goal of all of
that is to create lifetime customers using people, using technology, process and program
etc. To make that goal happen. So you know, when you think
about the other two that we haven't touched on as much here, we talked
a bit about people, we've talked a bit about technology and Mar Tac,
but then when you include process and program onto that, can you describe some
of the ways that you sort of holistically look at all of those categories to
drive lifetime customers? Yeah, you know, I like to use this eighty
twenty rule, which is eighty percent is a fixed goal, something that's repeatable
every quarter. You must do it to keep a customers engaged, to keep
our business going, and then you have twenty percent space to innovate, to
try something new, to take a risk, and you really look at everything
in this two places. Like what is my tech debt? You know what
am I long tail projects and they all go into that twenty percent and sometimes
there's a given take. Sometimes there are down seasons where we don't have enough
and there is already work that's sitting in the wings for somebody to pick up.
So you never have lots of time or loss of, you know,
space. So they twenty rule really applies to to these. The way that
I think is to always think about eighty percent fix and twenty percent allowing teams
to come up with, you know, projects that you know really in a
long term, maybe by loyalty. It may take several quarters to build something,
but it has an end goal attached to it, especially when it comes
to first time use experience for a customer inside the product. When it comes
to creating programs, it may take time to bake and a lot of times
we do have the rigid test and learn and let's do it fast as possible.
But sometimes you need to give time, you know, some some things
are just long tailed, some things just need time to discover itself. Sometimes
experiences can change the way customers by things like the environment at work from home
that started two and a half years ago to really change the way customers today
by stay with the Custodi stay with the brand, you know, want to
move. They are you know, decision levels have changed. So to meet
with that time you always need that twenty percent, you know, a duility
in your process to give time back to this ever changing, very volatile,
you know, digital space, and I would imagine that in that twenty percent,
to your point, you're exploring there, you're experimenting their your reevaluating,
you know, the approachch that may impact your eighty percent. So I love
the the way that you do that with that eedy twenty, because it just
feels like that twenty percent could lead to some fundamental breakthroughs that you might not
be expecting if you were only doing a hundred percent. You know, generating
sales. Yes, precisely. Yeah, Yeah, interesting. Now I know
that when we chat it before, I know that you've got really distinct opinions
about evaluating, you know, Mar Tech, when when to decide to retire
specific tools that are just no longer being effective at generating sales, and I
know that some of the ways you do that you look at the amount of
revenue that you're generating, the efficiency of the tech, cost of ownership and
more to sort of objectively evaluate whether or not any specific Martech platform is really
giving you scale or operational efficiency. So I mean everything that that you're doing
there just literally sounds amazing. So can you share a little bit more with
our audience about how do you how do you exactly do that in what advice
can you give to our audience on how to approach that? Yeah, again,
a very large subject to unpack in terms of how do you evaluate whether
you have the most current technology, whether it meets Your Business Requirements? But
it again begins with understanding your customer journey. Like every business, you will
see innovation in your space with technology and you want to adopt these new things.
But sometimes it's not the question of what technology is available and how can
we use it, but it's really more about what is the customer need and
is that technology that will help me get to that customer a little bit faster?
So it begins with I believe it begins with a customer journey. Draw
out your ideal state and say, look, this is what I'd like the
customer to do and be successful on my platform, on my service, and
I today I have are marking my technology stack across this funnel in this particular
fashion, and then evaluate whether that technology is meeting your expectation of speed,
scale, personalization and from there on evaluate what are some of the gaps in
the workflow in that technology and is it something that needs replacement? Does it
need optimization? Does it need, you know, better versioning? What is
it? So I think begin over there trying to identify your customer journey,
break it down into workflows, look at the technology stack and then evaluate whether
you actually need something net new. Once you have decided that you need something
net new, then it is about enablement and trying to adopt that technology.
The other way to look at it is also how your stack is set up
today. Are you in a hybrid stack, you know, are you using
different kind of tools composed together and you know, API died, or are
you looking at a single stack? And really evaluating single stack is very hard
because everything is in one place. If you're using, you know, a
sales force or adobe or Oracle, these are huge pieces of technology, and
then you have to look at, you know, where do you need to
drive better efficiency, like, are you doing something repeatable in a certain place?
Can Ai, you know, replace some of these repeatable action and you
know, where is it that you need some benefit from your data, etc.
And in hybrid places I think you have to look at what are,
you know, under used? You Know How many? How many people today
are using that platform? Are they enough governance in place and are you getting
the best out of that hybrid model? Do you want to move to singles
tax? So many multiple ways to look at technology. But fundamentally, if
I would advise somebody, start to look at your customer journey and say it's
your technology meeting that need. Is it like, you know, where the
pants that fit you? Don't oversize it and don't undersize it. That's a
wonderful analogy. Where the pants that fit you? That's excellent. So so
we've talked a bit then, about, you know, all of the depth
of experience that that you bring. We've talked a lot about current day in
how you're sort of approaching, you know, challenges that are facing marketing operations
today. Let's shift a bit to the future then. So if you look
five, ten years ahead, what changes and trends do you predict for marketing
operations? Yeah, I mean I think the challenge is going to persist,
which is how do you get prioritization alignment and then really focus on the right
investments in technology. But the the true value of operations is when you start
seeing this big picture as we I've explained to you earlier that we have to
really look at. You know, what does process, people and technology together
have an impact on? Today? There is no one tool that allows you
to do that. There is no operational tool today that tells me what is
my efficiency in my team. So I'd love to see innovation in that space.
If there is, you know, a startup itching for an idea,
here's it. There are a lot of operations people and organizations, bigger small,
and the trend today, the prediction in two thousand and twenty two is
that the semost first role is going to be an ops person, because it's
fundamental to the organization structure how you build it. And if that role is
so critical, it will require tools to get better at decisionmaking, and today
we do it manually. I think a lot of operations people do this manually
today. But if we can get a technology piece that is going to allow
to share how efficient teams are getting, a processor are getting and identify the
intangibles, then I think that will be great innovations and then would be the
next trend in operations is the other piece is going to be around consolidation of
technology. Really, what operations is looking to do is get an Omni channel
tool that's going to allow you to do multiple things from one single place and
orchestrated central because, as teams centralized ops, you'll have to centralize technology.
Have a central team. That is then democratizing the way technology gets use and
you only support it and you have governance and framework that will allow people to
do work more in an agile format, especially in countries that are small.
They're still expanding in there not enough resourcing. So really the consolidation of tech
is going to be the other thing that ops will be doing in the coming
future. And then it'll be centralized data. I mean, I think the
CDP platforms have become huge trendsetters in the market today. It is a next
you know, evolving market where everybody wants to have a single source of truth
and data because that's where the magic is. And really how to bring in
that CDB into your customer marketing campaigns is going to be the next thing that
ops is going to be worrying about and making it available. So yeah,
I do see a lot of innovation, a lot of excitement. I think
the role is becoming hot and people are seeing value in it, and technology
is just going to make it more beautiful. HMM, that's excellent. Well
in as we wrap up today's episode, what is something that you think everyone
in marketing operations today is trying to do that you think that you've discovered a
better way to do or that you've decided it to do differently? I think
everybody is trying to get clarity in prioritization. I think that is the number
one thing. Everyone's trying to figure out what is the thing I need to
work on and consolidating that goal across teams. I don't think that I am
yet doing anything drastically different. I think what we are doing well is creating
a good framework, a good governance structure that you will allow you to make
those decisions faster, and then really giving the you know, the empowerment in
the hands of the right people who know how to use that technology and know
how to run that particular workflow and leave it be, let them ride their
wave and let them do their things. So trust in your Sim give your
teams the flexibility to drive that project forward. And I think that is going
to make an excellent OPS team. It's about the people at the end of
the day. Excellent advice. Well, that wraps up this episode of the
art of marketing operations. Thank you so much for joining us today. They
have until next time, stay safe, take care and thank you for listening.
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